POLLS: Should We Lock Farming Rewards?

Hey TFarmers,

The subject has been brought many times in the TF Community, so I thought it would be good to have some unofficial polls to check what farmers think about the idea of Locking TF Farming Rewards and the different modalities this implies.

Please share your opinions if you think we could do this otherwise. There are endless possibilities on how to proceed. Let’s see if we can narrow it down to some specific options.

By locking farming rewards, we mean: the TFT received each month is, totally or partially, locked from being spent for a certain period. First we start with a general question, then we explore options on how to proceed.

Should we lock farming rewards?

  • Yes, we should lock farming rewards
  • No, we should not lock farming rewards

0 voters

If we lock farming rewards, how much percentage should be locked? (Choose one option)

  • We should lock: 100% of farming rewards
  • We should lock: 75% of farming rewards
  • We should lock: 50% of farming rewards
  • We should lock farming rewards, but a different % (if so, comment below the %)

0 voters

How long should farming rewards be locked? (Choose one option)

  • We should lock farming rewards for: 2 years
  • We should lock farming rewards for: 1 year
  • We should lock farming rewards for: 6 months
  • We should lock farming rewards for a different period than what is mentioned above (if so, comment below the proposed period)

0 voters

Once the locking period is passed, should unlocking of farming rewards be gradual or all at once?

  • The process of unlocking Farming rewards should be gradual (over time)
  • The process of unlocking Farming rewards should happen all at once (one time unlocking)

0 voters

If you think gradual unlocking should be done, please share how you think it should be done.


Thanks for your participation and please share your ideas and opinions on this subject if you have something to say!

1 Like

Are we considering locking rewards purely to maintain price stability or what other benefits could locking bring?

2 Likes

This is an important topic, we already talked briefly on Telegram yesterday, thanks for starting it here.
It is surely an effective way to avoid too much selling pressure. But it might also keep away some farmers if too much tokens are locked.

I think we should also consider some attractive opportunities for farmed TFTs like staking. Validators are planned to start during the next months. If it would be possible to stake TFTs on validators and receive an somewhat attractive interest farmers might choose that option. Staking is already planned but the amount seems low. 100k comes from the validator owner and 50k can be added by someone else.

So I’m suggesting, as one possibility, making staking attractive and rise the limit for TFT that can be staked on a validator.

3 Likes

I’m planning to start Farming, if the rewards are locked how Am i going to pay for the operation? This does not seem like a good option specially if we want to bring more farmers into the ecosystem

4 Likes

Combination of a lot of what I read above, that I think could be interesting 50% lock on a continuous 6 month release,

Reward period 1 earned gets 50/50 split, the second 50 gets released 6 months after the first and this cycle continues for each reward period. Basically instead of generating one transfer, 2 50% transfers are created, 1 is now 1 one is now +exactly 6 months.

The tokens that are locked are placed into a wallet for storage, can be staked on a validator node, a third option for a regular interest staking at a longer commitment would be cool.

Locked tokens could also be exchanged on a market between validators and farmers, creating a tetiary pathway where validators could purchase the tokens and stake them themselves peer-peer while maintaining the purpose the of the system. Gives people the opportunity to wait for the tokens or fully transfer the locked tokens to the validators in return for an agreed amount.

You would need to be required to still own the minimum staked tokens. But this could create an eco system that encourages peer to peer decentralized trades within the locked tokens that can be used to fund the initial deployment of a validator, increase staked amount, or a validator could offer farmers the ability to stake their locked tokens for a return % of the reward earned by them while maintaining ownership.

I feel like this would encourage not only more validators but also “validation communities” for instance

A few farmers could pool resources and go in on a validator that they then could place at the most reliable or highest powered farm, the group could then apply all of their individual locked rewards to the stake and recieve their rewards independently.

That same community could then create their own “offer” for other farmers to join the community for a returned percent. The minimum stake is still maintained by the validators primary owner at all times.

Essentially instead staking on an exchange, you stake within the community, while supporting validator network primary growth by offering validators community support, farmers additional income, or the ability to “sell” their locked tokens likely below market, but still within the confines of preventing sell pressure.

5 Likes

I think no lockup is best. Let the market set the tft value instead if artificially raising it if that is the goal by locking the release.

If the reasoning is to promote 3nodes to stay online for overall system stability that’s different. If that’s the case just unlock rewards in a continuous fashion, ~15% per month for 6 months.

I like how a monthly payment will be easier for taxes by reducing transaction quantity but dislike not getting rewards continuously for psychological reasons

6 Likes

Good question @Rasputin_Rick

The possibility of locking the TFT farming rewards has been discussed by Threefold for a while now.
The goal of this shouldn’t be to maintain price stability. Perhaps farmers talk more about locking TFT these days because of the market movement, but the subject of locking rewards was on the table way before.


There could be other benefits from locking the token, as @tackrack mentioned for example, it can be used, among other reasons, “to promote 3nodes to stay online for overall system stability”.


“if the rewards are locked how Am i going to pay for the operation?”

That is a good question @lay0 and that is, in part, why we started those polls and wanted to initiate some discussion. We want to have the input of Threefold farmers on this and see what is best for TF farmers and Threefold in general.


Threefold had planned for a while now to have locked TFT. But then some farmers argued that they would need at least partial unlocked tokens to pay for the operations.

So then some farmers proposed to have, at least, some tokens unlocked. Hence the discussion.

As of now, TFT farming rewards aren’t locked at all.

1 Like

Thank you farmers for you input. Let’s continue this and see where it leads. The more votes we get, the better representation we can have of what the TF community thinks about this subject.

Please continue to share your opinion and to discuss different avenues. We already have great ideas shared here. It’s getting interesting!

Let’s
New
Internet!

I would need to see the stats on how much TFT is being minted every month vs how how much is burned through utilization etc. It feels possible without some forced staking measure the price might find its home much, much lower within the next few months, just being a realist here as growth of 3nodes accelerates while sales/partnerships/tech development takes time. The idea is to put the problem off for two years, where in theory we’ll have the utilization issue more taken care of.

2 Likes

I struggle to understand the reasoning and fundamentals behind the locking principle. It was said that it’s not to support the price. But most comments are around “preventing massive sales”.

Can someone please explain what the purpose of locking is?

Lets just close the poll and do what Parkers suggested. This is the best option.

2 Likes

I prefer to understand why we lock before we select any options tbh. Creating an additional market for ‘locked’ tokens is interesting, but creates a lot of questions and needs really detailed processes to be worked out.

Market for locked tokens or even a locked version of the TFT sounds complicated. We also need a simple solution.

We should also sum up what locking the tokens is supposed to do. So far most arguments are

  • price stability
  • keep farmers on the network (loosing locked tokens when you finish farming?)

I still think staking options could be a good way to keep people from selling theor TFT.

1 Like

I’m sure some staff will chime in Monday.

1 Like

:slight_smile: It’s monday here already mate

1 Like

Some mild locking makes sense. I fell already in the trap of vesing most of my TFTs last year voluntarily, which prevented me from investing them usefully in a L0/L2 Validator node now… And as it looks right now, I will have to wait another 3 years to get my hands on my locked funds. Vested/locked TFTs should be available still for some TF internal programs/investments, but should be blocked from sales in the open market for a certain period.
my 2cts/TFTs…

1 Like

Imagine you go work for an employer, and he suggests to freeze your salary for a year before you can spend it…
Does that sound like a good idea?

1 Like

Hi there,

Just to add something to the discussion.

I think that locking farming rewards just to avoid selling pressure is not a good reason to proceed. Personally, I think it could be used to prevent farmers to remove their 3nodes all of a sudden since this would put huge pressure on the TF Grid, as it would need to reallocate data.

I’ll try and explain this, and please anyone correct me if I am wrong somwhere.

The data on a 3node is backed by a 20% overhead that is sharded throughout the TF Grid. This means that if something happens to the 3node, the data is never lost.

That being said, when one farmer removes a 3node from the Grid, without any notice (“bad actor” scenario), it gives a stress on the TF Grid as the TF Grid must then reallocate the data.

One of the reason I think Threefold would want to lock some farming rewards, is to make sure that farmers do not unplug all of a sudden their 3node for X reason, and then the user would be left with no 3node to store the data, this would give a pressure for the TF Grid to reallocate the missing 3node’s data.

With locked TFT, what could happen is that when a farmer decides to remove their 3node without notice, the locked TFT could then be used to deal with the reallocation of data. Once the data is reallocated, the remaining TFT is unlocked to the farmer.

In a more “good actor” scenario, the farmer would tell the TF Grid (and the users of the farm) that ‘this’ 3 node would soon be removed from the TF Grid and this would leave time for the user to reallocate the data (perhaps the TF Grid could do this automatically). In this case, there would be no TFT penalty.

So in my perspective, locking TFT, partially, could help prevent situations where a farmer removes a 3node and puts pressure on the TF Grid.

I’m also for a locking system which is in favour of people not removing capacity over night. One other thing which could smooth this out is if payouts were not always at the same time for everyone, but rather based on e.g. the date of start for the node, this way even if people decide to quit it would not be so most are within a few days of each other (after the monthly payment). This might not be the simplest technical solution, but it would make sure that the disconnects are more evenly spread out. Because chances are that people are mostly going to unplug after the payday.

The locking could also be selective and rewarding, e.g. only machines which have actual usage would get locked TFT’s, and only say 25%, but I would also reward them with a small percentage of the contract’s TFT’s for the service. So it’s not only punishing. Plus this removes locking for unused nodes which makes little sense if the locking is to prevent loads from getting plugged.

2 Likes

The locking does seem to be centred mainly around farmers dumping tokens like miners… if it’s to prevent farmers from unplugging their nodes over night there are some other services which prevent this with nodes having collateral for downtime. But that can get a bit complicated and often seen as high risk for farmers